let me put it simply: the laney cub 12R has all the stuff that you see listen in its specs and is seriously cheap. and sounds pretty decent too. the laney is wavesoldered on a conveyer belt in deepest china. the BE3 costs some 10k+ more BUT is bound to be a better amp and just sound better, being 100% handwired and having a V30 instead of whatever crap laney sticks into their amps. also, BE3 has a waiting period, ansar has his hands full now and does practically all the work himself. so there is a big price differential and you can't really directly compare the amps 1:1. if you have the budget and can wait a month or two, i see no reason why not to spend it on a better built amplifier. i build amps too, but i'll be honest about this - i can't match ansar's pricing. i'm also not taking any orders just at the moment, cause i'm thoroughly swamped in it.
#1 i have the budget #2 i have the patience #3 it will be a long term investment, so am thinking solution will be a better amp for me #4 celestion v30s are my fav speakers #5 i want a simple handwired amp which has been made by a dedicated man like ansar so, be3 solution 18 fits me, but i wanna clear out a point about laney and that is the <1w feature: <1w feature in the laney, i didn't really get that. Someone explain this sentence to me: "Plug into the <1W and you get .75 of a Watt output. This allows you to drive the amplifier as hard as you like, giving you masses of power amp compression and a pleasing break up for that elusive DARK ART tone." The other features of laney is not necessary for me like reverb, footswitch etc. and it has the celestion 12" speaker which i don't think is anyway better than the vintage 30, so another negative point of laney comes in. So the only thing am confused about now is the <1w feature. If this is cleared, then i'll be able to choose between the two, and the thread will end.
thehundredthone - THAT is why I was not giving any comments. I'm no one to validate you, mate. flood - My thoughts exactly. bcrich - You need to know how tube amps work for that. Research. Basically, as a tube amp gets louder, the tubes are eventually pushed past their 'clean' rating and they go into crunch (bluesy), then overdrive (you could call it distortion, but distortion is only one of the sub-effects of OD, I think), and then more and more. The really good sound (with distortion) is said to be at the higher volumes. Modern tube amps have two volume controls mostly (with exceptions like BE3 Brat and Blackheart Killer Ant). The single volume control ones are simple to understand - turn it down, lesser volume, cleaner sound. Turn it up (past it's 'headroom' area. Headroom - how much you can turn the volume up and the sound still stays clean. More watts = more headroom, so the 1, 5, 8 watt etc amps are made to satisfy the guys who want really good overdrive at not-so-facemelting volumes.) and you get crunch, and then distortion, which progressively increases as the volume is increased. Two volume controls (one is marked master/master volume, the other is marked gain/preamp gain/volume etc) - I'm not exactly sure of how they work, but just know that to get OD at low volumes - master down, gain up; to get clean sounds at high volumes - master up, gain down. Adjust accordingly. And at high volumes (not counting gain) you get speaker distortion (depending on what speakers you have) - it's a love it or hate it thing, some use it, some don't like it. (I think people say that the OD achieved with master volume down is not the same as when you turn it all up) Attenuation was also made to this effect. Basically, a 1 watt amp would go into OD at lower output volumes (it'll also have lesser clean headroom) than say a 10 watt amp. So the attenuator in amps are built for that (I completely forgot how they work >_>) Some say they suck tone, too (I don't know if they were referring only to the line or rack kind of attenuators). Off topic - I'm thinking of a flute/recorder/melodica/chromatic harmonica. Concert flutes are friggin ***ay, if I can disassemble and carry it's three parts in my bag without the need of a hardcase, I might pick that. Main purpose is to be portable, chromatic, and in demand for ensembles, be it classical as well as contemporary. Ima go ask a teacher x-P https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKQK5An2Iok (not perfect, but decent demonstration for me) Cheers people.
what ultrabot said sums it up pretty well. you can get all the goodness of a thoroughly cranked amplifier at a more tolerable volume (i'll warn you, even 1W is bloody loud through a high efficency speaker like the V30). ask ansar to add a VVR (variable voltage regulator) using a high voltage MOSFET to your build. he probably will know how to do that, and even if he's never done it before, it's a fairly quick fix. i built one into my marshall-based clone, and it's the best sounding attenuation i've ever heard. i can finally crank up my amp to the point where i think it's exploding, all knobs on 10, but i can share the same room with it without earplugs. i've tried and heard a number of other attenuator methods before and none of them sounded particularly good.
let me clear out the point first. so basically, tube amps have more drive and gain at higher volumes. so, the <1w feature allows you to have the same drive and gain even at lower volumes without turning the vol knob up. am i right?
Yes. In an all tube amp both the pre-amp and the power-amp stage are run by tubes. So you can saturate and overdrive both sets of tubes. The first tube amplifiers had only 1 volume control so turning the volume all the way up drove both the pre-amp and power amp, but more importantly it pushed the power-amp into overdrive which gave it it's saturated thick sound that you hear in most blues records. But like all of us, guitarists and studios back then couldn't always handle having the volumes ripping their ear drums to get that tone, so amp manufacturers created the amplifiers which had master volume controls. This meant that you had one volume control that would drive the amp harder, and a master volume that would control the overall volume. Now the only part of the amp that could be driven without having a very significant effect on the overall volume was the pre-amp section. So all the tube amps that have a gain control are letting you push the pre-amp tubes with it. The characteristics of pre-amp distortion are inherently different from power-amp distortion. Most significantly is the saturation and how it kicks in. It's hard to describe in words, but that full, fat, creamy sound on your favourite Clapton/B.B. King lead is from the power-amp being driven. For the sake of argument you can say that heavy metal guitarists use pre-amp distortion a la Mesa Boogie Rectifiers. Now as always there are the purists who cannot stand to have to use pre-amp distortion instead of power-amp distortion. They want that cream and they want to be able to whisper over it. Logically the first solution is to build a <1W amplifier which is meant solely for this purpose. But then that means having to own a separate jamming/gigging amplifier. Hence the search began for a method to scale the power-amp section down so that one could use the same amplifier for midnight bedroom practice as well as garage sessions. Many ideas have been flouted. Attenuators, Variable Voltage Regulation, London Power Scaling, etc. are some of the methods that have been used, each found to be better or lacking with respect to the other. For an idea of Power Scaling, check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dsilgygjinw And for VVR https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvihEfBHWQw Google is your best friend (and worst enemy, but I digress.)
so, <1w thing is pretty much like vvr and power scaling. so, can i get the vvr or power scaling or the <1w on the solution 18 separately?
ok thanks a ton! so i am gonna call ansar tomorrow or the day after for the: be3 solution 18 1x12 combo w/ celestion v30 speakers and VVR. good?
power scaling is: https://www.londonpower.com/pscaling.htm the VVR is simply another way to accomplish the same thing, which is (bigsurprise) scaling down the power. i scale the power amp and phase inverter, which seems to be the most recommended method. i'll try to make a clip or a video one of these days. EDIT: i would not try this with a VVR though. not sure how he does it on power scaling, but it sounds like you'Re inviting trouble using the simpler VVR circuit... "Can I run a Power Scaled amp without a load right into a mixer? • Yes. It is perfectly safe to do this, although you lose the benefit of frequency shaping provided by the speaker and the interaction of the output stage with the speaker. The POWER SCALE control reduces voltage and current stress on the output tube, so even at a fully saturated distortion output, the tube is under less stress than it would be subject to in, say, a 3W amp."
so basically, you're saying that power scaling controls the reduced voltage better and even at high distortions, the tube is less stressed than it would be after installing a VVR. so, power scaling though expensive, better.
the tube is less stressed with a VVR too. a reduction in plate voltage as well as power dissipation reduces stress on any tube. distortion has nothing to do with it. i think power scaling is just trademarked by KOC, and VVR is the poor man's version. also, i'm beginning to wonder if going straight into the mixer or another amp could technically work with a VVR too. 8 ohms is not necessarily 8 ohms...
^Well, what would you recommend to me and bcrich? I think I'll get this added to my amp as well when I get to, so do I (or we) tell Ansar to only add a 'VVR using a high voltage MOSFET', or something else as well?
Dana Hall has put up his VVR circuit for all to see and build their own. Point Ansar to the schematic and let him use it as he sees fit. Or order the thing (parts+instructions), give it to Ansar and have him put it in.
that's how i built mine. i used a couple of values from an older circuit by dana hall though. works like a charm. the newer circuit seems to be improved with an additional transistor, possibly for stability of lower-voltage FETs? not sure about why the made the change. they're on the download section of 18watt.com. you need to register at the forum to download those. otherwise, i think the dana hall circuit is fairly widespread... ansar will know, or i can pass it on to him as and when the time comes. the tricky part is heatsinking it or bolting it on to the chassis, since the mosfet should not make a connection to ground. i haven't heatsinked mine (IRF840B rated for 500V and 9A) and i haven't had a problem yet BUT i'm only acting on good faith that the FET doesn't overheat due to the very high rating. anyway, alll this isn't your problem - ansar is more than competent enough to handle it.
