whats this thing i see here on IGT?

Discussion in 'Music Talk' started by jayswami, Jan 12, 2005.

  1. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    i find that 90% of newbies want to learn the vocal melodies of a song on the guitar...

    why? can anyone explain?

    shouldnt they be training their ears to look out for whats being actually played on a guitar and then try to learn to play that??

    when i started, i never had the urge to play mukesh's mera joota hai japani ona guitar.. but i had wanted wanted to play guitar like in the song ajeeb dastan..
    see what i mean?

    what happens after u learn the vocal melody on the guitar?
    what does one do with it?

    can anyone explain?
    rizaaj likes this.
  2. rizaaj

    rizaaj Forum Leader

    Nice Notice... i see the same here..

    i guess that they think that the tune is the actual and infact the complete song.. without thinking about the background, the base ...

    i picked up guitar because i wanted to back my voice with nice rythmic music while singing and not to play the tune of a particular song... still cant understand y the newbies need to learn the vocal melodies..... Can any newbie explain why??
    (dont have the right to ask because im also very new here)

    anyways nice topic to discuss Jay
    theguitaristofm likes this.
  3. suchacutename

    suchacutename New Member


    u r so right and i m also one of them :p...i dont know why but i like to play the whole song nd not only the guitar part..i guess its like singing a song or something not sure why i like to play that way...may be its like u learn how to play the perticular instur in a song but then what next..i would feel wierd to play just a lil bit of inbetween and stop..so i think that is one reason i like to play whole song.. am i making any sense...

  4. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    suchacutename, u had the right idea when u wanted to learn and play the guitar part in that shuba mudgal song. There are enough guitar songs for newbies to stay interested..

    I think the problem is more deep rooted in the indian public's psyche.

    I think in india, vocalist is considered king.. or the solo performer to be more precise..

    thats the curse of carnatic and hindustani music. Bengalis are much better because of robindra shongeeth and community singing.

    but the common man in india just wants to humm and sing the melody.. and most of the time is oblivious of everything else, and doesnt appreciate orchestra, isntrumentation and arrangement.
    So in a song, the public notices the following in the decreasing order of importance.

    1> vocals
    2> interludes (which might have some solos)
    3> nothing else

    i call it the curse of indian classical music.
    this is one of the reasons why i had stopped playing for indian bands...
    the bands were not at fault.. the audience was..
    as a keyboard i had the worst job.. guitarists can at least dance and do circus in front of the public to get thier attention (knock knock.. look at me.. i am guitarist NOT VOCALIST.. i am playing this instrument.. thats the sound u r hearin.. KNOCK KNOCK)

    keyboard players cannot even do that, and half the time the sounds coming oiut of the kb resemble some other instrument.. so it gets more confusing for the musically naive audience.

    Thats my theory.

    the direct fallout of that is.. newbies trying to learn vocals on the guitar.

  5. guns n roses

    guns n roses Pro Guitarist

    ^ How do you classify them as newbies? it is the number of posts? the rank (tabber, Pro tabber...)? or them always asking questions?
  6. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    fine not newbies. 90% of the requestors here. I mean on IGT, tabs are synonymous with vocal melody :shock:

    how many times have u seen this response.. I do not want chords, but tabs.. for posts where I have given the chord progression+chord chart.
  7. tejas

    tejas ..........

    This is not something which is solely seen on IGT. Almost everyone i see these days, wants to play the vocal melody, cause they think thats what makes the song. I really dont see the point of that, but i guess its upto them. Who are we to say, what someone should or should not play?
  8. madhura

    madhura pani poori yum yum ....

    in my opinion this might be the reason why newbies go after vocal melodies :
    (i am not saying this is right or wrong or if or not it is a correct approach .....)
    its just my personal views and observations :
    1. tabs are a bit simpler than chords and require comparatively less practice ( epecially if somebody had already posted them) .....
    they sound close to song, and ppl get thrilled @ "hey look i can play a song"
    2. most of ppl like to do things ,they feel they can do ... ( stleast in the begining, ) and once they get a bit hold of it, they jump in harder things .....
    3. chords need extremly good sense of timing ..... but our casual listening to songs can figure of timing of playing tabs.
    4. its high chance for newbies to quit in the begining if they get frust playing chords and not able to believe that they cant play songs good enough. ( this is y most of ppl quit classical singing etc... ) ...... whoever is passionate enough, will find time patience and all that takes to learn chords anyways ....
    5. this might be one reason too : ppl who know bit of music or can play another instrument, can master vocal melodies in very less time and get thrilled by believing , they now know yet another instrument.
    ............... but i guess its all about comman humans and their way to look things especially when they have other priorities like academics , career etc....
    but ppl who really really really wanna learn guitar .... find their own way .....
  9. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    when i had gone to my village in india in nov, same thing happened. they got a harmonium and made me play vocal melodies of tamil songs. i was like whats the point.. so i called my cousins bhajana ghosti to bring their dholak and jalra etc.. and arranged all songs like bhajans.. and played harmonium back up.. it was so much fun.. that way and then they realised the point i was trying to make. ilayanila done like om jai jagadish hare is so much fun... than playing the vocal melodies without any music.

  10. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    this is what i think.. playing melodies the right way is not easy. the learning curve for that is steeper. hitting a note might be easier than hitting a chord..
    but playing a melody the correct way is much much tougher than strumming a chord progression. I think the amount of time you guys spend learning vocal melodies, if you spend half the time practicing strumming, you will all be ace rhythm guitarists by now.

  11. suchacutename

    suchacutename New Member


    i still have that idea in my heart...just not getting enough time on hand to work on it. many things to be done and want to do and just 1 me :(...i get ur point. like madhura said its a diff feeling when u can play a song. the whole song. plus i found tabs to be easy to play then chords themselves. i started off with chords but it got kinda complicated for me so as eager i was to play i switched to tabs. everything has its time i guess i will learn chords too in time...till then happy strummngg....
  12. abhay_saxena

    abhay_saxena Lord of the strings

    yeah i do agree with jay. . the problem is in the indian audience. .. indian audience does'nt appreciate anything other than singing. .. no doubt we have so many singing competitions coming up on television .. . all of them worse than the other. ... the problem is not with indian classical music. .. because classical music supports both singing and instrument playing like the harmonium,tabls the sitar etc ... but its the audience in the present world who does;nt understand that its not the singer who's doing a great job but the composer , . . just the other day i heard my mom's friend saying. ." kya gaaya hai sonu nigam ne in kal ho na ho " . .. i said its not his singing thats great . . its more the lyrics and the music composed that is great.. . .
    this is really sorry that people in india do not appreciate the value of instruments. .. how many people would love to listen to instrumental music in india ? i guess no one. .. no wonder indian music is going to the dogs with all the ****ty film music and the dog****ty music videos (read remixes) ... .
    in the western world (at least till the recent past ) people appreciated good music and not good singing. . .. and thats why they had a golden era in music in the 70;s - 80's . .. but not in india. .. . people still beleive that the singer is the one who's made the sing .. god damn such thinking
  13. propellerhead

    propellerhead Banned

    I agree too

    indian audience is like a shah rukh khan movie.
  14. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    thats not entirely true...
    emphasis is always on improvizations alaaps and solos.. u will have a dueling jugalbandi... the artiste gets noticed only when he is in the foreground in indian classical music... the background music player is the taanpura player :p:

    thats the mind set of the indian audience too..

    take the example of the percussive instrument jaalra... in tamil jaalra is the slang for a "yes"man who sucks up to others...

    to give u another example.. MG Shreekumar (the mallu dude whose thindari thindari thinthindoo mallu vocals appear in jeeya jale from dil se)
    was touring USA last year. I spoke to his keyboard player who was very talented.. but was playign this cheap ass casio... he said for every show the main star got 1000s of dollars.. where as musicians got 50$ per show.
    can u imagine just 50 bucks.... they were much more talented that that actress who danced for 5 minuts and probably got more money than all the musicians put together.
  15. abhay_saxena

    abhay_saxena Lord of the strings

    yeah thats true. .. musicians do not get the respect they deserve ..
  16. Venus

    Venus New Member

    ^ that's such a shame....just goes to show how unfair the music industry can be.......

    To be honest, i picked up the guitar to back my singing like Rizaaj, and when i initially started to want to play it, i realized many songs were given (on the net) in tab format. Having played that, it sounded crap and i realized that wasnt what i had heard in the songs i liked. So i started classing tab as shortcuts and to never to play them as an alternative cuz it screws the song up. Ino sum ppl who play vocal melodies on the guitar and sing along, but to me it seems that the song seems better if u play it as its supposed to be played (usually on chords of sum kind) and then sing. So i guess it's just a shortcut way of playing songs.........

    Nice thread, Jay.
  17. bob-bobby

    bob-bobby Extinct or Banned!

    i think times are changing and thats y we see more of bands coming in then of some solo crap singer, this should be kind of encouragement for all the musicians ...
  18. deathdr_87

    deathdr_87 Awesome Guitarist

    its a lil silly this obsession with vocal melodies - i wasnt alve too long back to know whether this happened 20 years back in india and i dont remember if this happened even 5 yrs back - but i attribute vocal melodies to the mobile phone ring tone culture - it seems those are always the melody lines!!!
  19. jayswami

    jayswami Blue J

    ^^^^ahahah, its the other way round.. mobile ring tones in india are vocal melodies because of the indian mentality.
    i have a polyphonic hip hop ring tone here.. pimp by 50 cents :p:
  20. madhura

    madhura pani poori yum yum ....

    i would request ppl instead of arguing on fact we all know ( reasons of which already been discussed) to suggest some solutions ..... apart from just saying "practice chords more" .......

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