HELP NEEDED: complete electric setup!

Discussion in 'Guitar Gear Talk Forum' started by v0id, Jan 26, 2006.

  1. v0id

    v0id New Member

    Hey folks,


    I'm going in for a complete electric set-up and I need some help. I've read most of the posts here on the gear forum still I'm not clear about certain points. Please help me out.

    Here are the relevant details:

    I've been playing the acoustic guitar for the past *8 months*. I am committed to it.

    I would like to play Metallica, Iron Maiden, SOAD, GnR, Nirvana etc. I'd like an allrounder kinda guitar :d (I don't think that exists..)

    My budget for the
    guitar is $400;
    processor is $300;
    amplifier is $200.

    I can manage to get the gear from abroad(except the amp.)

    *I cannot absolutely exceed the above quoted budget*

    My questions:
    1) Which is better: Individual Pedals or Pedal Processor? I understand that most of you guys recommend Individual pedals because of their superior sound. But, considering that I am a complete newbie to electric guitar(and probably not trying to achieve *that* particular sound right now anyway) .. what would you recommend?

    2) If I do go for a Pedal processor, I have to choose out of Digitech GNX 3, Zoom G7.1ut and Korg AX3000G.(GT-6,8, GNX4 etc. are out coz of the prices) Which is the best out of the three? I've read from reviews etc. that GNX sucks at usability(but that's ok with me.. I'm a complete believer in RTFM) and Zoom G7.1ut has a pathetic wah. Any other suggestions? Is the Boss GT6 worth it to put in an extra $100(it's priced at $400 at MusiciansFriend.com) or GNX 3 is better than it? LEFTY_GUITARIST, any ideas how is AX3000G compared to GNX 3?

    3) I've decided on an Ibanez RG 370DX (because I've read that Ibanez guitars are pretty all rounder guitars). My friends own Slammer and Aria guitars and they make statements like "Ibanez sucks.." etc. So, where does an Ibanez RG 370DX stand in front of slammer and aria guitars? How good is an Ibanez at playing stuff like Slash(GnR)? Any other guitar suggestions(within the budget) are definitely welcome. Chintan, deathdr (you guys own RG 370Dx..) please reply to this. Any idea when the 2006 series is out?

    4) I am completely clueless about the amplifier because I will be getting it from India itself. Marshall, Stranger etc are the options(ronnie says that stranger sucks) What is the best available under Rs. 10k?

    5) Is it OK if I go for a second-hand pedal processor/stomp boxes? What are the particular things to look out for in a second hand pedal processor? Same question with the amp?

    6) Which is a better buying option: buying in the US or in Dubai/Singapore?

    7) This may sound dumb but I'm pretty uncertain here..and I think this shouldve been the first question. Actually, all of this Ibanez Ibanez Ibanez everywhere has confused me a bit about the guitar I want: What kinda guitars do you associate with guys like (a) Jimmy Page, (b) Don Felder, Eagles (the electric part) (c) Joe Satriani (d) Van Halen (e) Slash (GnR) (f) Red Hot Chilli (g) Nirvana (h) Pink Floyd.. as in Fender/Les Paul/Ibanez type sound
    Please, this is the most important question

    Sorry for asking so many questions but I really want to make a right decision about the gear that I buy because I'm spending a LOT.

    I hope you guys help me out with my queries. Thanks in advance.
     
  2. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    LOL
    I will answer one ques at a time (to the best of my knowledge and experience)

    1. Individual pedals have better sound than processors, due to the fact taht processors have a processing chip inside them; the manufacturers in order to cut the cost, use cheap and worthless processing chips, whcih leads to using of simplistic DSP algorithms.
    That leads to bad sound. Ofcourse, processors can sound good. Solid state racks sound wonderful, but given the huge processing power.

    So in most of the cases the pedals (taht are anolog circuits) win over processors.

    If you are trying to copy an artist's tone, Processors might be easier, but to get your own tone, pedals are better.
     
  3. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    4. For amplifier, you can have a look at Rolands.
    Rolands will be expensive, but they have better builtin distortion (but then since you aer going to buy a processor, who cares about built-in FX).

    Marshall, wins. It is cheap, has great clean tone (it has overdrive too, but you wont be needing it). Mess around with EQ and you still will have wonderful tone. Reverb is good too.
    Go for teh one that has built-in reverb.

    Stranger, cheapest option. The only thing bad is that it gives horrendous tone unless you are expert in EQing.
    I have found that by keeping Bass:5, Mid:0, Treble:10, I get a decent tone. Otherwise it sounds bad like "fart"
     
  4. sridhar11_2

    sridhar11_2 Instrumental guitarist

    For the processor I say go for the Zoom cause it has a tube powering the drive function and it will sound more natural. And i've always liked zoom products plus this new series of pedals from zoom is getting a lot of attention and good reviews everywhere.
     
  5. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    ^^^
    That tube in a processor sound more like a marketing gimmick to me than anything else.
     
  6. sridhar11_2

    sridhar11_2 Instrumental guitarist

    That may be true but i somwhow trust that the Zoom pedal will be better thab the other pedals cause i still find my 505II good enough. Plus the zoom has

    96 kHz sampling
    24 bit A/D/A conversion
    20 Hz - 40 kHz Flat response
    120 dB SNR

    35 amp/stomp modeling
    92 effect types, 9 simultaneous
    80 user patch + 80 factory patch
    6 band EQ

    20 tube amps, modeled by 32 bit DSP
    Energizer powered by real tube 12AX7
     
  7. v0id

    v0id New Member

    Okies, since I am not any good at EQ-ing, neither do I have any experience etc. I have decided upon Marshall as the amp. Can I know the various options in the Marshall amps(available in Delhi) and their *current* prices. Thanks.
     
  8. sridhar11_2

    sridhar11_2 Instrumental guitarist

    I dont think you get anything but the MG series from Marshall. The only range that you can choose from is the reverb one or the DFX one. I'm not sure of the prices though.
     
  9. v0id

    v0id New Member

    Looking at all features in a Zoom 7.1ut, I was certainly impressed. Does anyone here own one of those? Because a few people own GNX 3 and they have given good reviews for it. Anyone with experience with a Zoom 7.1ut please come forward and share your experience.
     
  10. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    7. Guitars
    Jimmy Page: Gibson Les Paul
    Don Felder:
    Joe Satriani: Ibanez
    Van Halen: Kramer, Charvel, Peavy Wolfgang, Steinberg
    Slash: Gibson Les Paul
    John Frusciante: Fender Stratocaster
    Kurt Cocaine: Fneder Mustang, Fender Jaguar
    Dave Gilmour: Fender Stratocaster

    To tell you the truth, if you are using a processor, it doesnt matter whether you get a PRS or a Squire. You can make them sound similar, and it will always sound digital.

    Ofcourse, playability is a different issue altogether.


    And the pickups matter. Humbuckers do well for most of the distorted stuff, but somehow I love the twangy sound of single coil pickups when playing overdrive or clean.
     
  11. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    Whoa!
    All that sounds like the crap thrown by Intel and AMD at the gullible buyers of computers.

    THE MOST important thing in the procesor are the processing speed as well as the quality of DSP algorithms, which no one advertises.

    96kHz sampling may matter, but the 24 bit A/D/A will only produce subtle increase in perceived resolution. Hear a 16 bit signal and compare it to 24. The only real diff will be heard in very loud or very silent sound.

    20Hz-40kHz Flat response
    The guitar signal is lowest @50Hz.
    And the max signal including the higher harmonics (which cause the charachteristic distortion sound) is perceivable upto 15kHz.

    Why do these MARKETING companies try to mislead public?


    6 BAND EQ is very good though. It wil allow you to change the complete charachter of the tone.



    One suggestion to the processor companies:
    They should advertise how close their emulation is to the real thing by displaying the wave graphs. That is the only quantitative way of measuring the quality tones
     
  12. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    Phew!
    You need to check a lotsa things.

    1. Check for the pedal. Is it firm? Can you reach the max and the min?
    Usually all teh pedals have teh on/off button underneath - that is when u press real hard you should be able to turn it off/on.
    2. The knobs: are you able to twist them fully. Are they firm. What about the corresponding change in teh parameter - eg a knob for volume should be able to change it from min ot max
    3. Check backside: has it been opened once? If so then u should ask why.
    4. Ensure that all the switches/pedals/knobs/buttons are in working condition.
    5. Plug in the processor, play around.
    6. Play thru all the company presets. Usually teh compnaies make presets that highlight all the charachtersitic of the processor.
    7. Change the settigns of the presets and check if evrything is workign as expected.
    8. Check for all the ports of the processor: Line in, Line out, AUX, Headphone, AC Adapter, USB, etc
    9. The Battery option should be funcutional. Not many ppl use batteries, but then since you are paying for it, why dont you check that too.

    There are lotsa things that i must've overlooked now; Others will add.
     
  13. sridhar11_2

    sridhar11_2 Instrumental guitarist

    The only company i saw with this ad policy is V-stack
    http://www.musictoyz.com/guitar/pedals/vstack.php

    I'd really love to have these pedals
     
  14. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    ^^^
    COOL!

    I saw somewhere a magazine had done some reviews about AMT pedals.

    There they had made done the waveform analysis of all their pedals.
    Here: http://usr.kgbamplification.com/p/reviews/reviews_amt4.jpg

    The wave forms shown there shows a clear realtion between the presence of harmonics and tone.
     
  15. UjSen

    UjSen *#!EVIL*!!

    u all r scaring me!
     
  16. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    If your are getting scared because of all the mathematics and physics involved.
    Probably you should.

    And now you can imagine how difficult it is to select gear and guitar.
     
  17. v0id

    v0id New Member

    Thanks alpha1 for your informative replies and thanks to sridhar too.

    The Mexican Strats are also around $360(same as Ibanez RG370DX) but they just have single coil pick ups. So, versatility wise.. RG 370 DX(with two H and 1 S) is a better option than the mexican strat?

    Please other gear gurus; help out with my queries.


    Especially when you have so many options to choose from; and it's so f***ing expensive that you can go for a major upgrade once in 2-3 years.
     
  18. DrSaurabh

    DrSaurabh Wh@+s Up D0C

    i dont know much ...
    and as much as you will hear ppl bashing marshall here...
    beleive me...mg series is quiet good
    i got the mg 30dfx
    and i like it, the clean channel is good....and the drive is killer
    it has a bass , contour and treble control.......and playing around with it u can get pretty much all the tones the cube 30 will give you....
    the dfx includes flanger delay reverb and chorus....i just use the reverb and delay the max...
    foot switchable channels
    i dont need a processor...with all this... as of now....tho am lookin for zoom g2.1u
     
  19. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    LOL
    Doc: no point trying to emulate other artists tone.

    I have a processor, and belive me I feel it to be an overkill.
    Besides, am fed up of trying to get some ___ artist's tone. It doesnt happen.

    For you the best option will be get an overdrive pedal.
    and if possible then get a footswithc for your Marshall's channel switching.


    That way you can have the Overdrive on/off using the chanel footswitch
    + you can add to the gain by switching on/off your overdrive.
    That way you wil have 4 tones.
     
  20. chintan9

    chintan9 yay! i won the ipod!

    1)Which is better: Individual Pedals or Pedal Processor?

    In my opinion a processor is more than sufficient to meet the needs of any Indian guitarist. It gives us very usable tones, it is super easy to use(atleast most are) and they are definitely cheaper than a good pedal setup.

    2) Which processor do I go for??

    Well this is really difficult to say. If I had the same options as you I would probably pick the Zoom G7 over the digitech and korg for the very fact that its technology is unmatched, it has a tube and has the fastest patch change which in my opinion is VERY important(in a band situation). The digitech GNX3 is also a great buy but the difficutly in editing is a huge turn off(imho). But it has this really cool recording feature which is a huge plus point. I didnt really like the Korg AX3000G, coz it lacks the features and seems too similar to the old crappy Korg AX1500G.

    3)Ibanez 370DX??


    Your friends seem to be super jealous of the fact that you are getting a killer Ibanez RG and they still have stupid Slammers and Aria :p: which SUCK in my opinion!!! Go for the 2005 version which has the EDGEIII bridge and INF(dimarzio powered) pups.
    PS- I am not really sure if Ibanez will come out with a new and improved 2006 version, but if they do I suggest you look out for NAMM2006 coz thats where the official announcement will be made.

    4) Which Amplifier??

    I would personally choose Marshall or Roland(cube 30 preferably). Both kick ass!!!!
    PS- Dont go for second hand amps.

    5) Is it OK if I go for a second-hand pedal processor/stomp boxes? What are the particular things to look out for in a second hand pedal processor? Same question with the amp?


    If you get a good deal then go ahead and buy it! Processors are pretty safe imho.

    6) Which is a better buying option: buying in the US or in Dubai/Singapore?

    I guess all the three places mentioned are great for equipment. USA is relatively cheaper but Singapore and Dubai aint far behind.
    PS- I think Dubai is duty free, so you might wanna check the prices there.
     

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