Gandhi?

Discussion in 'The ChitChat Lounge' started by horsesmouth, Aug 16, 2012.

  1. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    Why Godse Killed Gandhi??? | Rajeev Ranjan

    Now I have a feeling many people might hate him, and for valid reasons too.
    But, what isn't justified is people denigrating the person as a whole, calling him a manipulator and defector. Its no doubt that he was concerned about the welfare of the nation, nor stimulated by self-interests. In Godse's own words: "I don’t refute Gandhi’s theory of non-violence. He may be a saint but he is not a politician."

    Worse is the hatred that has been spread over the past 60 years. He did all he could, as a proponent of peace must do. If he hadn't approved Pakistan's independence, there might have been endless killing, till god-knows-when. Sure, his policies were not conducive to India's social and economical well-being, but, through it all, he had no insidious motives.

    Let's just accept it, he was needed to the whole nation till he was, and was removed from the cards when he wasn't required. It was time for him to go, and he was made to leave by some future thinkers. But it doesn't disparage his earlier sacrifices, and his efforts to realize his dream. He was a saint, albeit one who ultimately turned senile.[FONT=lucida grande, tahoma, verdana, arial, sans-serif] [/FONT]The time has come now, that we stop calling Gandhi a traitor, and at the same time, beatifying Godse and his actions.
     
  2. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    "Non-personal" hate* is a nothing but a result of propaganda.

    One might hate Gandhi for being / doing whatever he did wrong in the eyes of "right wing", but why? Only because you've been led to believe that the "right wing" way is the only correct way ...
    Similarly, One might hate Godse for assassinating Gandhi, but why? Only because of the way it has been presented to the world ...

    Anyway in my opinion, killing someone means you really believe that the person is a big threat to your plans; and this usually comes out as a last resort ...

    About Gandhi's role in Pak independence and the aftermath - it would've happened anyway. The seeds of this had been sowed by the Brits very long time back!


    * Non personal hate - refers to hate that doesn't arise from your interactions or experience.
     
  3. vivek.gaur0816

    vivek.gaur0816 VivekLoveRock....

    You've explained your opinion with logical information. Well done.
    As for your opinion, it's yours to keep. I'm not going to debate but just want you to see these videos..

    Why Nathuram Godse (Martyr) Killed (So Called Mahatma) Gandhi - Real Reason Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi Killed - YouTube
    Some historical facts & Sex Scandal of Bapu Mahatma Gandhi- Thanks to another Singh for exposing - YouTube

    Also I'd like you guys to watch a movie Lord Mountbatten - The Last Viceroy

    Now, that’s not obvious, and if you don’t believe it, I don’t know any way I might convince you.
    But if that does pass through your filter, you may be well on your way to understanding Gandhi.
     
  4. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    @alpha1
    Yes, non-personal hate. But why? What propaganda are you talking about?
    Nobody is forcing anybody to be a Right-ist or left-ist. Infact most people who hate Gandhi don't connect that with being Right-ists either, even if they are one. Its just a hearsay, rumors about his scandals, his ***ual orientations, and so on. Isn't that personal vilification? Isn't that unfair to talk about on a national-political scale?
    And not all Left-ists don't hate Gandhi too.

    @vivek
    Logic tells us that what isn't officially recorded isn't totally true. Tomorrow I might make a video about anyone, claiming anything. But is it true?
    Secondly, what irks me the most is people calling Godse a martyr. Was he? He was a scholar, an editor, everything. And just because he did what nobody else could doesn't make him the same. That was required I agree, but he obviously killed a peaceful man (for being a bad decision-maker) who never thought of hurting anyone.
    As for his *** scandals, he himself talks about a few things in his autobiography that were not scandals, but would certainly lower his image of a saint. He never wished himself to be called a mahatma. He was a human. And from all I've heard, people even claim he was g@y. Now who knows if that's true or not. And until its scientifically proven using historical records, its unfair to believe it.

    Don't call him Mahatma, don't call Godse a martyr. That would be fair to both of them. Even Godse would have liked it. He in fact had profound respect for Gandhian methodology, though he believed Gandhi overdid it in the end.
     
  5. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    By propaganda I just meant that information that is spread - either by state or by few individuals - for some vested interests and not for the sake of information.

    So pro-Gandhi side information is (rather was) spread by Congress and old "freedom fighter" era people (you know how camaraderie sometimes leads to doctoring of information).
    Pro-Godse side information was (and more vehemently these days) spread by the right wing/conservatives.

    And of course these days it has becomes fashionable to hate Gandhi.
    (Perhaps Vivek Gaur belongs to that group).


    My stand is that since I have not had any experience with these two "gentlemen", I cannot hate either one of them - and I find it absurd that people can actually belong to one camp or the other.

    Of course I totally condemn one thing in this whole episode: someone killing the other person.


    Vivek, there are more idiotic videos and documentaries made by people "proving" that the American moon landing was a hoax.
    That aliens have visited earth and US armed forces are deliberately hiding stuff.
    That miracles and para-normal stuff happens and can be explained by "blah blah" theories ...
    That world will come to an end with 2012

    The world is filled with morons, when you stop using your brains and start agreeing with the moron, then you are being an idiot.

    (a good example would be the whole fiasco about Bodo vs Bangla muslims - and how that has spread to outside Assam!, ecatly because of some gullible idiots)
     
  6. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    Your words are exhaustive in itself. I couldn't find anything more to tell, other than that I agree.

    But what about India blaming Pakistan on the bulk SMSs used to instigate the Assamese exodus? Is that propaganda too? Why isn't this matter being arbitrated by an international (UN-esque) jury?
    In the end, its us who are at loss. But its all politics in the end.
     
  7. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    One can never know.
    Unless a Wikileak happens!

    ;)

    That's why I am all in for Wikileaks (for both the sides).



    PS: But thinking logically, Pak has everything to gain from such incidents in India.
    Come to think of it - Bangladesh, immigrants, muslims, "tribals", insurgency, terrorism, civil war ...

    And knowing the gullible ultra idiotic provocable Indian public ...


    You don know how we were a piece of cake for the European powers a few centuries ago
     
  8. thehundredthone

    thehundredthone New Member

    The general public has no idea what to do with information like that from Wikileaks. The world is complicated, not even Wikileaks can uncomplicate it. That being said, I'm not against it, however what is an outrage now can become acceptable tomorrow, society is fickle like that.

    Pak will have something to gain from any untoward incident in India. How about we blame the current inflation rate on them too? Sure, the message could have originated from there. So what? No 'Indian' did anything to stop the spread.
     
  9. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    Refer to the piece of cake idea in my last post.
    That is what indian public is and always has been.
    Dumb mute spectators, while people come and plunder time and again.
    Dumb mute spectators that are willingly instigated to turn against own people.
     
  10. thehundredthone

    thehundredthone New Member

    They're not dumb and mute when they are part of the bigotry and violence. The difference is only whether they're out on the streets acting on it or at their dining tables agreeing with it.
     
  11. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    But who can judge violence as justified? Everyone will talk in a place as big as this. Its people who listen to some crap and decide that they are meant to eradicate this 'evil' all by themselves.

    And in a place like India, wikileaks will only lead to further chaos. As if this is not enough.

    P.S.: This evening I saw a bus near Pune station being checked through by bomb squad. Any news?
     
  12. Ramila

    Ramila New Member

    There seems to be no good reason why people should hate Gandhi, especially after what he has done for the country. I think every Indian should do their bit for other unprileged Indians. Yes, I have done my bit too.. I am sharing this video by Jumpin (JUMPIN: Nani Vs Naani, the Dance-Off (Funny Grandma Animation Video) - YouTube) which is contributing to Save The Children NGO with each share.
     
  13. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    but in the absence of wikileaks, govt can use propaganda to project anything as the sole truth ...
     
  14. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    ^ We have tehelka, the cheaper equivalent of the same. And what has it achieved till date besides playing a part in uprooting BJP's 2 term rule?
     
  15. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    What tehelka?
    What scams have they uncovered?
    What leaks have they brought out?

    And even if they did manage once to uproot someone's "rule" - I think that is solving the purpose.
     
  16. horsesmouth

    horsesmouth Active Member

    Thats my point...
    I bet this inaction is due to bureaucracy...
     

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