Coming back to life?

Discussion in 'The ChitChat Lounge' started by kaiser, Apr 26, 2006.

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  1. kaiser

    kaiser Bored

    I think one should have a philosophy in life that has no contradictions to be happy (in the purest sense)....mine's got plenty, but im working on them. i think thats what make philosophers, well, philosophers. they keep discussing, arguing....about things like ethics, morality, life, religion etc and make an effort to reason and come up with a rational philosophy, which makes me respect them, because good thinking is so difficult its almost a skill! And its amazing how so many great philosophers had different opinions about almost everything under the sun yet they are considered 'great philosophers' of all time...

    now the point of this thread is, i got some more questions (but didnt name it 'strange questions' ...haha, do we have a 'sheepish' smiley in here?) I want to know what you think. this isnt about 'is there god or not? or 'is religion necessary or not?' Im not contesting any believers beliefs.

    Id like to know how atheists/ agnstics/ go about their philosophy.

    Im an athiest and against the concept of religion and worship. i dont believe, in spirit(as in and body being two different things...So here are my questions:

    why cant a dead man be brought to life? whats the scientific reason? being an atheist i cant justfy this fact. believers easily say: the guy gave up the ghost...and its an irreversible phenomenon. the ghost goes to heaven or hell. (Ha! I find it funny that most believers dont think that animals and plants have 'ghosts' too...) will it ever be possible to to bring a dead person back to life? of course, i mean someone who'se just died, but is healthy and obviously not cremated yet!

    this happens to be a contradiction thats eating me.
  2. sixstringsin

    sixstringsin ||||||

    well i first thot this threadz abt pink floyd .. @ topic: if seeing is believeing ...i've seen a ghost (actually an evil spirit) and so did a few friend of mine back in our hostel ..which was near a graveyard ( is swear :) ) ...and so I'll be the last person on earth to not believe in ghosts... i think (i know ) fu dead people do come back to life .. i have no scientific proofs to jot in here though ..had the chance to meet two of them in my life :) it was scary !!
  3. the_wizard

    the_wizard Omega == God


    on topic: me not an ateist...but I just dont follow the bondages of my religion.
  4. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    1. I am more of Agnostic leaning towards Atheism.

    2. I believe human beings are very weak creatures - psychologically and physically.

    3. I believe religion and god are necessary concepts, necessary because of point 2.

    4. Religion is also required because by default, human beings have animal instincts, however, our social norms actually shun those animal instincts.
    Religion provides basis for social norms.
    Now you may say: Bah! I have animal instincts to survive, why should I need society etc.

    Rememeber: Our societies were formed so that the even the weakest and most unsuitable human also survive. Incidentally that also increases the survival rate of "better" humans.

    5. God is a very good concept for explaining un-explicable incomprehensible phenomena.
    All Humans have a trait called Curiosity.
    And we tend to feel let-down/put-down whnever that trait is unsatiated.

    The concept of God fills taht vacuum.

    6. Regarding bringing back to life thing - First define life and death.
    Then we shall talk about bringing a dead person to life.
  5. kaiser

    kaiser Bored

    I didnt ask you that.

    Neither did i ask you to justify whether god exists or god and religion are necessary.

    Nor did i ask you about animal instincts and societies and survival rate of human beings. by the way, what EXACTLY are you trying to say, that religion is the basis for the social norms that shun our animal instincts, and that the society increases the survival rate of better human beings?? what do you mean? and what made you think that i might say that i have animal instincts, and that i dont need a society? whoa....please explain.

    i know about curiousity, i just checked the dictionary. anyway, do you agree that the concept of god is one that conviniently fits as a subtitute for answers abt the universe that we dont have yet? would you shun the concept if unexplicable phenomena suddenly became explainable? bt-fukin-w, nothing quashes curiousity more than religion or the concept of god. there i go, doing exactly wht i said i wont do. why dont you read and then post?

    if you understood my question, you wouldnt be asking this. still, if you insist, you can look up a dictionary.
  6. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    ^Ah you are just a stubborn kid.
    No point "talking" to you.
  7. sachoo

    sachoo drenched in my pain again

    Everything in on this earthis a truth but mythical. Probably a set of protocols or tales defined by one or other (for any of reason) became religion n adoption in terms of God/godesses. Nature and it's power (+ astrological components) governs them all > Light, Water, Air, Earth (or soil) n fifth element (universe or antariksh)

    Life and death is a huge theory which is never known by either but the YOGI's who can leave their body to death n them can take it back to life >> wat u r luking for (however i hvnt seen this so dont belive).
    As for existence of spirits, i cant say coz hvnt seen them tho i know ppl who firmly belive in them. Then Human body is always considered as the best machine ever, so dont think much bout it's mechanism, emotions, brain n all.

    Even doctor's have seen dead people coming back to life n they all see same thing when dead as a spirit or something. Again reincarnation comes into topic (on of my friend has his previous life memories as a kid). We have called spirits n all but still i dunno if i belive in them.

    This is again a huge topic n vast topic to discuss, so better dont get into it. good for time pass.

    So let's go back to future......................................;)
  8. nehemiah

    nehemiah New Member

    sixstring not doubting.... you but then again, men back from the dead r part of ur contact list
  9. shsnawada

    shsnawada Cyborgs & Pasta

    Religion can be a good or a bad thing depending on what you want (apart from religious "satisfaction" or commiting no sins or something of that sort):

    - Its good if you want a lot of happiness/peace for yourself and others (if theyre religious aswell)
    -Its bad if you want progression (mostly scientific) of the society.

    Personally, i'm for the latter. But its not really useful to discuss. Because if youre religious, there's virtually no real way that you can change your view because in the back of your mind, the question would most likely be something about events that we cant explain.

    And in an athiests case, the statement would be that religion is a human creation. ( i'm for this )

    All of that assuming that youre not into organised religion. Also assuming that you see a difference between mythology, ethics, religion and faith/belief.

    Now wait for vini's respone.
  10. sachoo

    sachoo drenched in my pain again

    Is this for me ???? but still .. if u r for latter then y u say it's bad. n it doesn't conclude for one to be athiest if u say it's human creation.. tell me thing which is not created by human other than nature n universe.

    LOL n how come Vini eventually came into picture ...heheehe... anyways
  11. shak

    shak Harrr!

    and so is havin good punctuation in your posts! especially, if you are 'tryin' to make sense ...
    why cant be dead brought to life again? beacuse they are friggin dead for Godsake! (oops 'God'sake,haha sorry mate i should rather say for 'i dont belive cuz i am bloody daft' sake) ..
    naa naa, i am only kiddin,dont take it seriously, being an atheist is purely a matter of opinion and choice and i totally respect that, and yeah i admit i dont have an answer to your question .. sorry but its just one of those things ...
  12. shsnawada

    shsnawada Cyborgs & Pasta

    er.... no, but nevermind
    Well, in general, religions try to block the curiousity. And curiousity leads to progression. On the other hand, religions generally leads to discipline, inner happiness and that lot.
    Well, nature is the universe and vice versa. Anyway, my point was that the line of thinking of an athiest would be distorted/filtered by his thinking that people have made up religion so that they could explain what looks unexplainable in that point of time (that would include solar/lunar eclipses in 1000 BC for example).

    Well, wait and see :grin:
  13. sixstringsin

    sixstringsin ||||||

    i slide my forefinger on the first string it does not hurt anymore ... :shock:
    ...wait let me pinch myself ...yup it hurts a bit .. looks like im alive :)
  14. kaiser

    kaiser Bored

    @sachoo: Stay off my threads.

    Looks like there are no hardcore athiests here...

    @alpha: how was i stubborn? do you want me to agree with the zilch you posted? and i really am confused bt the religion-society-animal instinct-survival thing man...please explain.

    @shak: uh....yeah i know being an athiest is a matter of opinion and you respect that.....yawwwn... i was expecting something readable from you. and my punctuation? what was that about....?

    @shsnawada: here you go again. this thread isnt abt religion......anyway, im surprised vini hasnt closed the thread yet. haha. thats the only way she can respond!
  15. sachoo

    sachoo drenched in my pain again

    oops.. i realized lately, tht's u .. :beer:
  16. alpha1

    alpha1 I BLUES!

    An athiest is as big an ignorant as a devout religious zealot.

    BTW I dont still laugh at your first post.
    You still havent told how will you define when a "living being" becomes "dead".
    Especially since you are an atheist and would not believe in concept of soul.

    Since you refused to get it last time, I called you stubborn.
  17. kaiser

    kaiser Bored

    how is it that no adjective preceeded 'atheist'? going by your post, probably, only the moderately religious are not ignorant. is that what you want to say?
    what do you have to say about an irreligious theist? is he an ignorant too?

    i couldnt care less whether you do or not.

    This is exactly what I i would like to know too! this is what i dont have an answer to, my friend. i said that believers have a way of justifying by saying that the soul separates from the body rendering the body 'lifeless'. you're asking me the same thing. what is it that makes one 'lifeless'? what is it that make a body 'alive'? the soul??? what if i dont believe in soul? then what is it? and i want an athiests answer. i want to know how a fellow atheist thinks about this phenomenon. i want to know, assuming that there's no such thing as a soul, can one be brought back to life? i know there're no mad scientists in here who can answer this to the point, but a conversation wont harm anyone.

    so, if i dont happen to agree with you, im stubborn? err...dude....whoa...! haha...!
  18. shak

    shak Harrr!

    well the concept of life and death is hard to explain without bringing in the concept of a supreme being who has put it all together .. and as you dont believe in such suprme being called "God" it would be impossible to give you any rational explanation for all this but lets put things into perspective and you can decide it for yourself ..

    it is well known that to have a start of life you need amino acids, and then amino acids join up to form proteins, 1500+ amino acids in 'one' and only one particular order to be exact, now if you put this all to chance like atheists do, baah thats a big big game of chance, its like having a slot machine with 1500+ drums each havin 200+ figures on it and then you pull lever and wait for them to line up in one exact form .. how long would it take you? 10^260+ years .. more than all the atoms in the universe ..
    now do you really think life happened out of chance?
    fine you've got protiens, now protiens on their own are no good you need them to multiply, but proteins cant multiply!! they need DNA to multiply .. but DNA cant exist without protiens .. so for life to begin you need DNA and protien to form at same instance!!! put this to chance as well??
    then all the favourable conditions on earth ... the sun the moons, the universe .. its a big ask!!
    so if you put all life to chance and then refuse to believe in god who made all this .. then i am afraid i cant explain the matter of life and death to you .. because its even more complicated if put in a rational context ...
    think about it ...
    life is nothing but carbon, iron, calcium, nitrogen, oxygen, phosphorous plus a few more elements ..when they exist out of body they are nothing .. its only when they come together in some weird and non understandable way that they become alive and work toegther .. once they leave your body they are as dead as firewood .. to make life work you need all these elements plus a sheath or cell to contain them .. inside the cell they live outside they are just elements ... and the sheath or shell itself is made out of same elements that it encloses!!!!

    so its wierd. . at one step or another you have to accept the presence of something extraordinary .... making all this happen!! i call that God :)
  19. Petunia

    Petunia terminally dorky

    ^^ imma gonna back here..gotta run now.
    so leave me some space. ;)
  20. taxyse

    taxyse t3h.

    Garima likes this.
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