#1 - Learn To Count

I must really push you guys to learn to count first,
Not as in counting money but counting BARS and MEASURES

Please ask any musician friend of yours to explain TIMINGS like 2/4 , 4/4 , 3/4 , 6/8. etc, and try to understand what is a BAR and to understand BAR COUNTING.

This has to be physically explained i feel, the books cannot explain this in a very effective way.

This becomes very important, and once u know to count, u will not require chord charts with lyrics asking u to change at a particular syllable in a word.

Meaning:
If you need chords for Papa Kehte Hain
you will not need

.....Papa keh te hain ba da naam ka re ga
..C..............Am...............F............... G

u will only require chord charts that go
Papa Kehte Hain:
Key: C
Time 2/4

Sign: [/ C / Am / F / G /] - (2)
Cross: / C / C / Am / Am / F / F / G / G7 /

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SUMMARY
#1: PLEASE LEARN BASIC COUNTING, BEFORE ATTEMPTING SONGS
This becomes very important, so that u understand that a musician has nothing to do with lyrics, he plays bar to bar.
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nice... but cant i learn it online .. . i mean from the internet... or by books.. sounds stupid bcoz u ve already mentioned...

but can you give some tutorial on counting... will be really helpful...

Nice thread bandbaaja, will be better in the Guitar tips, tutorials and lessons forum. Thread moved.

oh ok, i thought its a beginner's thing, and not for advanced dudes
sorry again, i seem to be really goofing up in placing my threads out here

riyaaz, will have to find a way
will try to do something, maybe explain it by way of a song, which i feel is a nice way....
gimme some time to think....
subhro....jay......help

most of the osngs i know ( meaning i can play) are 4/4 or 3/4 ..... do u have an example of 6/8 .... not on top of my head right now ....

Originally Posted by Bandbaaja

riyaaz, will have to find a way
will try to do something, maybe explain it by way of a song, which i feel is a nice way....
gimme some time to think....
subhro....jay......help

i wud like 2 highlight one line or rather one word of urs..
subhro ... Jay... help..

R U OUT OF UR MIND ????????????

in case u dont seem2 know.. let me giv u a valuable piece of info...
I AM NOT IN THE SAME LEAGUE AS U GUYZ (u & Jay & some other pros) ... he he.. and thats not modesty dude.. thats a fact

i'm crazy abt guitar but my knowledge abt guitar is vry close to 0.. no lessons 4m ny1 or nythin whatsoevr..
i can somewhat figure out the notes of a song & the solo in it.. (and that 2 i mastrd aftr a lot of practice coz i had no basic knowldge of music evr b4) i just try 2 link the chords somehow but they r not prfct.. nevr evr figured out a 7th, 9th 13th etc in a song myself..

just this othr day i was readin some tutorials how 2 figure out the major chord frm a major scale.. 1-3-5..

nywayz.. that was offtopic...

i wud like 2 echo what riyazz said..
if its possible in nyway 2 represent the stuff u just mentioned.. kindly do it.. i know its not easy.. still..
thnx a lot in advnce...
& also thnx 4 that line of urs.. 'subhro...Jay...help' vry flatterin indeed..

most of the osngs i know ( meaning i can play) are 4/4 or 3/4 ..... do u have an example of 6/8 .... not on top of my head right now ....

the song Lajjavathiye is in 6/8
if u r a northie,im sorry u wouldnt have heard this one

To get you started, the "time signature" represents two numbers x/y which can be deciphered like this: The upper number (x) represents the number of beats in one bar. The lower number tells you how many beats constitute one wholenote duration. Thus 4/4 means there are four notes per bar (count 1 (loudly) 2 3 4 1(loudly) 2 3 4) and 4 such beats form one wholenote (i.e. each beat is 1/4th the duration of a whole note). The duration of a whole note is decided by the tempo at which you play.
Disclaimer: Based on my limited knowledge, hope this is correct.

Originally Posted by mathai

the song Lajjavathiye is in 6/8
if u r a northie,im sorry u wouldnt have heard this one

thats a horrible horrible song aaargh i hate it
i am playing it on feb 26th anyways i am

i never understood all the differences between 3/4 and 6/8 4/4 and 2/4

i think i kinda know.. i just go with the feel when i play.. baandbaaja do u know i dont count.. in fact i have big arguments with some percussionists who will count till 48 and a half before starting a song etc..
i agree one should know the various meeters.. i kinda know them intuitively i guess..
like someone told me that allah tero naam has a complex taal.. (forgot name in hinustani)
it goes like 123-1234 i guess that would make it 7/4... but i have never counted anything while playing that song before...
so i am wrong guy for rhythm.. it is very ironic..
i spend a lot of time thinking and reading abotu melody and harmony.. dont spend half the time analyzing and reading about rhythms.. maybe i should start doing that.

I recently attended a rhythm workshop held by a tabla player. He gave some really nice insights into rhythm.
He stressed the point that we must forget about counting and have a feel for the time. He insisted that you must think of rhythm without thinking of numbers, cos numebrs tie you down. He gave some simple excercises to think of feel for rhythm without getting caught inthe numbers - heres one:
Count the following: 1 2 3 4 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 4 3 2 1 2 3 4 4 3 2 1 2 ... and so on
and CLAP after every four beats, starting on 1. So you go 1(clap) 2 3 4 4(clap) 3 2 1 2(clap) 3 4 4 3(clap) and so on. Remember to do this without looking at the numbers.. just count in your head and clap. This will help you keep a four beat cycle without thinking about the numbers. This can be extended to 5,6, 7 or any beat cycle.
Of course u need to know the time signature of a song before you start playing it, but once you are into it the rhythm must go by feel rather than counting.

thats what i do... also if u r the counting kind.. if someone else screws up.. u will find it impossible to adjust... such people end up as the "reset" kinds.. the musicians ultimate nightmare.. have u seen those vocalists who screw up.. then restart from the begining of the cylce in the middle of the cycle.. i wonder what they think man.. really..
i think they just reset their counter to 0 and start counting again

speaking of counting kidns.. there is this girl who sings here .. she has carnatic background.. she has this wierd way of singing.. she keeps wigling and slaps her ass real hard repeatedly for the count.. its hilarious

Originally Posted by jayswami

i never understood all the differences between 3/4 and 6/8 4/4 and 2/4

i had the same question in my mind...i think 6/8 is faster than 3/4(techinically
i know the diff.)somebody can come up with a better explanation i guess....

and jay,about lajjavathiye,it was the national anthem of kerala for the last
year

mathai